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Town of Bristol Budget Committee Minutes January 12, 2009
APPROVED ON: 01/26/09 as amended
ATTENDED: Andrew Hemingway (Chairman), Dan Bouchard (Vice Chairman), Ron Preble , Richard Walenda, David Carr, Jon Thouin, Paul Simard, Ashley Dolloff, Tom Winn, Andrew Williamson, Brenda Fritz, Dorcas Gordon, and Bruce Van Derven (Selectmen).
ABSENT: Diane Marden (Secretary).
OTHERS PRESENT: Paul Weston (Town Manager), Jennifer Coreia (Consultant), Rick Alpers (Selectmen), Paul Fraser (Selectmen), Joe Denning (Selectmen), Don Milbrand (Selectmen), various Department Heads, and members of the public.
The Chairman, Andrew Hemingway called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m., at the Old Bristol Town Hall, and the meeting was video taped for Bristol Public Access.
Minutes
Ron Preble made the motion to postpone the minutes and correspondence until the next meeting. Jon Thouin seconded the motion. MOTION CARRIED 13/0
Selectmen Discussions
Chairman Hemingway asked if any Budget Committee members had any questions of the Board of Selectmen at this time. Bruce Van Derven stated he does have a question and would be an active Budget Committee member this evening. Mr. Van Derven asked each of the Selectmen of everything contained within this years budget what two items are the most important to them in this budget? Selectmen Alpers stated making sure the second half of the pay scale is funded. Selectmen Fraser stated it is going to be a difficult year but he would like to see the pay scale funded. Selectmen Milbrand stated he would like to see Bristol retain the people who are currently employed for the Town of Bristol. Selectmen Denning agreed with the other selectmen, but added he would like to also see the tax rate decrease.
Selectmen Discussions Continued
Chairman Hemingway stated the consensus is the Selectboard is that they would like to see the second half of the wage scale funded, and to make sure the people we currently employ are retained. Mr. Hemingway continued to say that Selectmen Alpers had stated he does not want to see safety equipment such as air tanks, safety vests, etc. removed from the Budget, and that Selectmen Fraser would like to see the budget level funded holding the line on the expenses we currently have.
Dorcas Gordon asked the Board of Selectmen if they thought it would be a better idea to go to the Department Heads to see where the budget can get cut or randomly cut the budget in order to achieve funding the pay study as well as level funding the budget? Paul Fraser stated he does not think it is an unreasonable request to ask the department heads. Richard Walenda stated the pay study should not have been implemented last year, as the General Government Center had no idea what they were doing. Mr. Walenda stated everyone should have received a dollar across the board. Bruce Van Derven asked that with all respect he would like Mr. Walenda to stick to asking the Board of Selectmen questions relative to their recommendations. Jon Thouin stated one of the recommendations he saw in the recommendations of the Board of Selectmen were repairs and training that could be done at a later time. Mr. Thouin continued to say how would the Board suggest the Budget Committee to determine how these things can be done? Paul Fraser stated the Board of Selectmen are giving them their suggestions, but the budget committee needs to find what their priorities are within the budget. Mr. Fraser stated not everyone will have the same priorities, but to come to some sort of an agreement on things. Mr. Fraser stated is this computer for example done or can it last another year, and the department head will be straight forward with their answers. Selectmen Denning stated the Town Manager also has a good idea, but the roof on Town Offices needs to be done. Mr. Denning stated according to the Highway Department Superintendent he thinks some of the roads can be put off this year. Mr. Denning stated by talking with the department heads, these things get narrowed down to what needs to be done and what does not need to be done this year.
Chairman Hemingway asked for additional questions from Budget Committee members. Paul Simard read RSA 32:17 Duties of Governing Bodies or Other Officials stating the Budget Committee has always received a line item budget from the Board of Selectmen each year. Mr. Simard wanted to know why that Budget was not submitted to the Budget Committee? Selectmen Fraser stated when talking with DRA and reviewing the statutes it became apparent that the Budget Committee should also be working on this budget, and under the statute the Selectmen wanted to offer the committee the opportunity to work on the budget as well.
Bruce Van Derven asked if the Board of Selectmen would be satisfied with the Budget Committee if they spent what was spent last year or less even if the tax rate had a slight increase or would they rather see the tax rate not increased to at all?
Selectmen Discussions Continued
Selectmen Alpers stated he would be extremely happy to see the tax rate stay the same or less. Mr. Alpers explained the sad part is that we are not working with the County or the School District, and if we do our part the tax rate could still increase. Selectmen Fraser explained that he does not like the term level funding but would rather hold the line spending no more than last year, but to expect the same amount of services is unrealistic due to the cost of living. Selectmen Milbrand explained he would like to see the exact same or less as last year, and would like to see it actually lower to give some of the taxpayers some relief as times are difficult. Mr. Milbrand stated even though the CIP items are important he suggests looking at that to see what can be put aside for another time. Selectmen Denning stated he would like to see a decrease of 5% in the budget, but that would be drastic in times of such needs. Mr. Denning explained social service agencies and emergency services tend to be needed more in bad times. Mr. Denning explained maybe things like Old Home Day and other activities should be cut in his opinion. Mr. Denning stated he does not like it, but maybe funds can be raised to have some of these things occur.
Dorcas Gordon asked if it is appropriate for the Budget Committee to zero line items like Fire Betterment and things like that? Ms. Gordon asked what Fire Betterment is? Selectmen Alpers stated the funds go to water and sewer that is used towards hydrants. Selectmen Denning stated he believed in his budget he had zeroed it out, and put it into a contingency fund. Jon Thouin asked is the Selectboard willing to support in other ways by taking things out like for example sidewalks and things like that? Mr. Thouin explained things such as sidewalks could take some funds out of overtime, equipment, and other things that sidewalks may effect. Selectmen Alpers stated he would support some things but not specifically sidewalks because of safety issues.
Chairman Hemingway thanked the Board of Selectmen for coming to answer questions stating at this time there are no further questions of Budget Committee.
Budget & Deliberations
Chairman Hemingway stated we have had the Town Managers budget recommendations for six (6) weeks now, and now we have the Board of Selectmen’s recommendations. Mr. Hemingway stated what he is looking for in this exercise is to come up with a template budget that the Budget Committee can work with. Mr. Hemingway at this time passed out his budget worksheets.
Bruce Van Derven asked if Chairman Hemingway’s purpose was to provide a document that the Budget Committee can use to revise the budget throughout the process? Mr. Hemingway stated that was his purpose giving budget committee members something to work with.
Budget & Deliberations Continued
Chairman Hemingway explained before reviewing the numbers he had looked at each Department historically by reviewing the Town Reports from 1997 evaluating each budget. Mr. Hemingway stated he used those numbers as a guideline, then he put in the Selectmen’s recommendations, and then started to filter them through the budget. Mr. Hemingway then took the Mr. Carr’s notes, the Town Managers recommendations, and with all these factors I was looking to see if we have been consistent, and we have. Mr. Hemingway stated after reviewing all of this, it is his opinion that this budget is too much.
Dan Bouchard asked Chairman Hemingway what he meant by the Budget is too much? Chairman Hemingway stated he means to big of a cut in this template budget that he has prepared in order to instill conversations that need to be had amongst the budget committee. Paul Simard asked where Mr. Hemingway’s budget leaves the tax rate? Chairman Hemingway stated the tax rate in the template is at $4.95, and the current tax rate is $5.35. Dorcas Gordon asked if Mr. Hemingway’s budget has taken the wage classification study and keeping all positions? Mr. Hemingway stated he did factor in both, and he also left a dollar in every line in order to leave line items open giving department heads some leeway.
Paul Simard stated his budget that he wishes to present does keep the pay classification studies second half in the budget, but his budget does positions. Mr. Simard stated most of his cuts were within the Police and Fire Departments. Mr. Simard continued to explain that he cut three (3) positions in the Police Department because in NH the average Police Department provides two (2) people to every 1,000 in population. Mr. Simard stated that had put us at 3,200 people with six (6) police officers. Mr. Simard stated the Town Manager had recommended $911,000, his recommendation is $620,000, in 2007 a total of $780,000 was spent, and this shows a $40,000 difference.
Paul Simard explained in the Fire Department his recommendation is $700,000, and in 2007 a total of $724,000 was spent. Mr. Simard stated he did not take much out of the Highway Department Budget because he feels that department is run pretty well. Mr. Simard stated he would hand out his budget showing his bottom line at $4,483,000 stating that in 2007 the budget was $4,400,000, which his budget is about $80,000 more than what was spent in 2007.
Bruce Van Derven asked Paul Simard to explain Fire Betterment? Mr. Simard stated years ago they went to an enterprise fund explaining the water/sewer wanted funding for taking care of the hydrants. Mr. Van Derven asked if this is just a transfer of funds from one department to another. Mr. Van Derven asked what his purpose is for zeroing out line items, if funds were to come in there would be no line item to put anything in. Mr. Van Derven asked what department heads Mr. Simard spoke with? Mr. Simard stated his proposal comes from the written documentation and the department requests. Mr. Simard stated these are his recommendations.
Budget & Deliberations Continued
Bruce Van Derven had out his proposed budget to the Budget Committee. Mr. Van Derven stated he also prepared a budget by reviewing Town Reports for the past 5 years stating he did not look at the bottom line, but focused more on spreading the pain out over the entire budget. Mr. Van Derven stated some items were cut larger than others while some only had small cuts. Mr. Van Derven stated he did not zero out any line items, but chose to leave a dollar in the account to keep the line item open. Mr. Van Derven stated he also looked at the department head recommendations, Town Manager recommendations, Board of Selectmen recommendations, as well as spoke to department heads with the exception of the Fire Chief which we do not have. Mr. Van Derven stated he tried to keep in mind the service we all want, but made it smaller. Mr. Van Derven stated he reduced the stipend of the Selectmen by 3%, he also only put a dollar in the Consultant line item as the Town Manager stated we would not need this person for an extended period of time.
Bruce Van Derven stated he reduced all the legal funds throughout the entire budget, and that was under the assumption that if you give an attorney $25,000 he will spend that plus. Mr. Van Derven stated the essential emergency services are necessary and he did not cut any positions. Mr. Van Derven stated he put one dollar in the bike path primarily because of easement issues, and it did not get as far as we had hoped. Mr. Van Derven stated rather than spend $200,000 for a sidewalk, why not asked the abutters to spend $2,000 to get an easement. Mr. Van Derven stated these are some of his way of thinking when preparing the proposed budget. Mr. Van Derven explained some of his reasoning within the highway department road construction by doing partial road construction rather than none at all.
Bruce Van Derven stated the Contingency Fund in his proposed budget is no longer called a Contingency Fund its called the Contingency Infrastructure Matching Grants Fund. Mr. Van Derven explained he did this because Contingency Funds and we never touch them, and the department heads have money that they built in but they never move. Mr. Van Derven stated he proposed $50,000 in the Infrastructure. Mr. Van Derven stated he also added a Grant Funding Line to show that dollars have been raised, and now we can add some to it. Mr. Van Derven stated he has spoken to DRA about this, as well as the Town Manager at great lengths. Mr. Van Derven stated his proposed budget increases the tax rate to $5.67 which is a thirty-two (32) cent increase per year. Mr. Van Derven stated his proposal is well thought out, and takes a lot of consideration of many things. Mr. Van Derven thanked Paul Simard for his hard work, and explained he appreciates the time the Chairman put into the budget.
Chairman Hemingway asked for additional questions on Mr. Van Derven’s proposed budget. No questions were asked. Mr. Hemingway stated he also appreciates all the hard work put into these proposed budgets. Mr. Hemingway stated he would like to entertain a motion at this time supporting one(1) of the three (3) proposed budgets handed out this evening to use as a template or a place to start for further budget deliberations. Budget & Deliberations Continued
Dan Bouchard made a motion to accept Chairman Hemingway’s proposed budget as a template based on the facts that none of the line items are zeroed out and that the tax rate is at $4.95. Bruce Van Derven seconded the motion.
Dave Carr made the motion to amend the original motion to delay accepting a template until Budget Committee members had a chance to study each proposal. Ron Preble seconded the motion. Chairman Hemingway asked for discussion.
Paul Simard stated when you look at all templates each person had some of the same things in mind, and we should hold off to accept a template. Dorcas Gordon stated she does not have a problem accepting a template to work off, but that the budget committee does need to study each of the proposals for next week. Dan Bouchard stated once we vote on the amendment, it will delay the original motion until next week. Bruce Van Derven urges committee members to vote on the template, not the amendment because we need to move forward with deliberations. Mr. Van Derven explained that all the amendment does is move things into another week explaining that we will at least all have the template to work on for next week’s deliberations.
Chairman Hemingway took a three minute recess at this time.
Chairman Hemingway re-explained the original motion above, and explained the amended motion also stated above. Dave Carr commented that he would like the opportunity to study the proposals before choosing one as a template. Paul Simard stated when positions are cut in a proposal things should be looked at more carefully, and we need to digest this stuff. Bruce Van Derven stated you can study these budgets all week, but come next week you can vote in what changes or additions you wish to make. Mr. Van Derven strongly recommends not voting for the amendment. Mr. Van Derven stated all that is being decided is choosing which proposal to start deliberations with. Dorcas Gordon stated she is thinking it is important to support the original motion and not the amendment to give of something to start with next week. Dan Bouchard stated he made the motion because he too is looking for a starting point, and felt that the Chairman’s proposal had a lot of information that he had liked. Chairman Hemingway restated the amendment below, and called for a vote.
The amendment made by Dave Carr amending the original motion made by Dan Bouchard, was to delay accepting a template until Budget Committee members had a chance to study each proposal. Ron Preble had seconded the motion. MOTION DEFEATED 4/9
Chairman Hemingway restated the original motion below made by Dan Bouchard and seconded by Bruce Van Derven calling for a vote.
Budget & Deliberations Continued
The original motion made by Dan Bouchard was to accept Chairman Hemingway’s proposed budget as a template based on the facts that none of the line items are zeroed out and that the tax rate is at $4.95. Bruce Van Derven had seconded the motion. MOTION CARRIED 11/0/2-abstentions
Chairman Hemingway asked if it is the will of the committee to start deliberations this evening. Ron Preble made the motion to start deliberations on Monday, January 19, 2009. Dan Bouchard seconded the motion. Chairman Hemingway asked for additional discussion. MOTION CARRIED 13/0
Bruce Van Derven stated the roll of the Budget Committee is to prepare a budget, and we are in the kitchen now. Mr. Van Derven stated over the next week we need to be discussing things over the week, emailing each other, and working on the budget. Mr. Van Derven invited everyone to email him with any questions anyone may have.
Ron Preble made the motion to hold the Public Hearings at the Old Town Hall rather than the cold Elementary School. Jon Thouin seconded the motion. Chairman Hemingway asked for additional discussion.
Paul Simard asked where the Town Meeting was going to be held this year. Bruce Van Derven stated at the Old Town Hall.
Chairman Hemingway asked for a vote on the above motion. MOTION CARRIED 12/0/1abstention
Adjournment
Paul Simard made the motion to adjourn at 9:30 p.m. Ron Preble seconded the motion. MOTION CARRIED 13/0
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